Tracy Morgan

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Tracy Morgan

Post by markgunnells on Sun Jun 12, 2011 10:08 pm

Am I the only one who thinks people are going overboard with this Tracy Morgan hooplah? I mean, were the things he said outrageous and offensive to me personally? Yes. But is he the first comedian to say outrageous and offensive things, to be totally un-PC? Of course not. It's not humor that appeals to me, but then I don't have to go see one of his shows. People in Hollywood can decide if they want to work with him or not based on how they feel about this, but this public outcry seems to be a bit much to me. Am I alone?

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Re: Tracy Morgan

Post by Bordo on Tue Jun 14, 2011 8:53 pm

Nope. You're not alone. It's ridiculous.

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Re: Tracy Morgan

Post by Kenwood on Wed Jun 15, 2011 3:06 pm

Tracy Morgan plays funny characters, but he's never really been a funny comic. Plenty of comics try to go for the dark, angry humor angle, but sometimes it fails. Miserably.

The media reports that he went on a "vicious homophobic rant." Did he? Or did he just do a misguided and foolish bit? He apologized, said he's an equal opportunity jokester and that he went too far. Why isn't that enough these days? Sometimes, by God, some people make mistakes!

The funny thing about society today is just how hypocritically hateful we are. You know, Morgan goes on a supposed hateful rant, yet his apology won't be accepted by a vast majority of people who will continue to—you guessed it—hate on him.

I love this quote: “All those gay characters he portrays—it’s always clear he’s making fun of gay people, merely fueling those lispy-voiced stereotypes that have really gotten so stale.”

Morgan is so hateful that he even portrays gay people as characters for the sole purpose of fueling that hate, perpetuating that stereotype. Pffft! Fuck you.

Why can't we let people make mistakes? If they're truly sorry, it'll show in their character. If that's who they truly are inside, some hateful man or woman, then it'll come out again and we'll all know the apology was less than genuine. But to not accept a man's apology outright? Sure, it's your right, but it's rather condemning of your character, not someone else's. I'd rather surround myself by those who are openly hateful than those delusional, self-righteous turds that think they have the moral high ground when in fact they're wallowing in hypocrisy.

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Re: Tracy Morgan

Post by Bordo on Wed Jun 15, 2011 3:14 pm

Ken: well said.

I know this is going to sound pretentious, mainly because I'm totally smarter and better than all of you, but every time something like this happens I can't help but think about Emmanuel Goldstein from 1984.

It seems most people need their Two Minutes Hate these days.

Or, to put it another way: We have always been at war with Tracy Morgan.

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Re: Tracy Morgan

Post by Shiney on Wed Jun 15, 2011 8:54 pm

We ask for it. Comedians have been an outlet for decades. In the 70's and 80's...cemedians tackeld everything that was taboo. Homosexuality, race relations, drugs...they did it and it was laughed at because it was not out there in the mainstream.

Fast forward to now. Primetime TV is littered with profanity and things that would make most normal people blush and on the other hand we have pinheads forcing PC down our throats...the outcome is this.

Was his routine funny. No. Misguided probably, but he is a fucking comedian. And you should expect that sort of thing and they should NOT have to apologize to you. FUCK YOU, actually.

Listen to some early 80's EDDIE MURPHY or SAM KINISON...listen to mid 70's PRYOR....all fucking geniuses. All, not one foot near PC. And they never had to apologize for their material.

Ladies and gentlemen...we are big smelly awful pussies. We cannot think or take responsibility for anything. We need people to tell us what we like,. what is funny and now what we should be outraged by.

Big Brother can suck it.




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Re: Tracy Morgan

Post by markgunnells on Wed Jun 15, 2011 9:14 pm

I fear though that I am considered a traitor to my people for my view on this. Wink

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Re: Tracy Morgan

Post by Shiney on Wed Jun 15, 2011 9:30 pm

You can never be a traitor unless you betray yourself.

Be honest in how you feel and you're golden.


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Re: Tracy Morgan

Post by Bordo on Wed Jun 15, 2011 9:41 pm

In the 70's and 80's...cemedians tackeld everything that was taboo.

Remember the Saturday Night Live skit with Chevy Chase giving Richard Pryor a job interview? It's the one with the word association at the end. Man, could you imagine them trying to get away with that today?

I fear though that I am considered a traitor to my people for my view on this.

Depends on who you consider 'your people'. Wink

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Re: Tracy Morgan

Post by markgunnells on Wed Jun 15, 2011 9:42 pm

Well, I am the gay writer who has had some of his work considered "homophobic" before because I utilize gay villains as well as heroes, so go figure.

So I'm officially declaring the folks of Shock Totem as "my people."

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Re: Tracy Morgan

Post by Kenwood on Wed Jun 15, 2011 9:45 pm

markgunnells wrote:I fear though that I am considered a traitor to my people for my view on this. Wink
Some probably do see you that way, but they're dummies. They've also become what they fought so hard against. Human nature is a sick thing. Take a group of people—women, homosexuals, blacks—that were persecuted for ages, give them freedoms and liberties they once couldn't openly partake in, and what happens? Yeah, they sink right down into the same human pigshit.

Not all, of course, but far too many.


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Re: Tracy Morgan

Post by Bordo on Wed Jun 15, 2011 9:55 pm

So I'm officially declaring the folks of Shock Totem as "my people."

Cool. Me, too.

Since we're on the subject, I'd like to ask a question: is that how you think of yourself, as a 'gay writer'? Not how you identify yourself to others, mind you, but how you identify yourself in your own head.

The reason I ask is because I've always thought it must be hard for people from...for lack of a better term...sub-cultures with which they strongly identify and are expected to strongly identify by both fellow members of that sub-culture as well as outsiders.

In other words, no one is ever going to tell me that I'm not 'black enough' or 'gay enough' or 'feminist enough' because I'm just a regular old hetero white guy. I'm not expected to identify myself as anything other than a 'writer'. Unless complete honesty is expected in which case it would be 'crappy writer'.

Anyway, just curious. I know it's a personal question so feel free to tell my to mind my own.

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Re: Tracy Morgan

Post by markgunnells on Wed Jun 15, 2011 9:59 pm

I just think of myself as a writer. If I had to sub-categorize I'd say I'm a "short story writer in a novel world." lol It is hard though, if I mention my sexuality too much I get told I better back off because I don't want to be considered a "gay writer" or "alienate the heterosexual male fanbase." On the other hand, I am proud of who I am which includes being gay and I don't like the feeling I've gotten on some boards that they're okay with me being gay as long as I don't bring it up, and I do love seeing more gay writers in the horror genre, because I have loved the genre all my life and think we can bring something to it. If any of that makes sense.

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Re: Tracy Morgan

Post by Bordo on Wed Jun 15, 2011 10:03 pm

Makes perfect sense.

I think that the people who identify as gay above and beyond anything else would take issue with your stance on the Tracy Morgan thing.

But, honestly...those are the kind of people we could all do without anyway.

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Re: Tracy Morgan

Post by Kenwood on Wed Jun 15, 2011 10:09 pm

I don't think anyone should call themselves a "gay writer." It's those kinds of distinctions that caused so much hate in the first place, right? I mean, can I refer to someone as a "gay writer" without being called a homophobe? Hell no! I'd get slammed for it. It's a bullshit distinction.

This is why I am 100% against gay marriage. There is NO SUCH THING!

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Re: Tracy Morgan

Post by markgunnells on Wed Jun 15, 2011 10:12 pm

I don't seek out being called a gay writer, but it doesn't hurt my feelings either. I mean I'm both gay and a writer so it doesn't bug me if you put them together. Or a male writer, or a white writer, just throw all of it together. lol

I guess I'm in the position of not wanting to be defined by my sexuality but also not wanting to be made to feel I have to hide it or downplay it either.

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Re: Tracy Morgan

Post by Bordo on Wed Jun 15, 2011 10:20 pm

I guess I'm in the position of not wanting to be defined by my sexuality but also not wanting to be made to feel I have to hide it or downplay it either.

Which is how I feel people should be with any 'classification'. Or, as Ken would say...and I agree...with any 'bullshit distinction'.

This country is way too fucking Balkanized as it is.

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Re: Tracy Morgan

Post by Kenwood on Wed Jun 15, 2011 10:28 pm

markgunnells wrote:I don't seek out being called a gay writer, but it doesn't hurt my feelings either. I mean I'm both gay and a writer so it doesn't bug me if you put them together. Or a male writer, or a white writer, just throw all of it together. lol

I guess I'm in the position of not wanting to be defined by my sexuality but also not wanting to be made to feel I have to hide it or downplay it either.
I don't think you should hide your sexuality at all, but "writer" should suffice. My only problem with adding things like "gay" and "black" to things is that it keeps the trenches between groups of people too deep. If people want distinctions, there can't be unity among people. If "gay" is a title and not just a single aspect of someone, then it's something people won't be able to look past. Being gay or black or transgendered should be no different than having green eyes or brown hair, you know.

I guess I just dislike labels. No one looks at me and goes, "Oh, he's a straight white writer." That would be kind of silly, right? So "black writer" or "gay writer" or "transgendered writer" should be equally as silly.

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Re: Tracy Morgan

Post by markgunnells on Wed Jun 15, 2011 10:30 pm

It's not a distinction I seek out as I said, but there is a double standard. People will read my novella ASYLUM and call it a "gay horror tale" because of the sexuality in it, but no one calls something a "straight horror tale." We just don't live in a world yet where my sexuality doesn't matter to people, whether I want it ot matter or not.

And I always say I'd rather be known as "that gay horror writer" than "just some other horror writer." lol

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Re: Tracy Morgan

Post by Shiney on Wed Jun 15, 2011 10:37 pm

This is another prime example of a great thread...intelligent...and entertaining, and how many folks have chimed in? Um...like 4.

pfft.

I agree with Bordo and Ken..."Writer" should suffice.

I could market myself as "Pasty pudgy white writer with bad muthafucking sideburns," but I do not.

Labels are for suckas, and believe you me, there are plenty of folks out there dying to label you FOR you....leave it up to them. Just write and be good at it and be happy with yourself and what you do.

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Re: Tracy Morgan

Post by Kenwood on Wed Jun 15, 2011 10:38 pm

I hear ya. I just take a harder stance when it comes to these things. I grew up befriending good people, not just people like me, you know. I tried hard to see beyond those differences that are walls to so many of us. Thus I had friends of all color, gay and straight, male and female. So I just have strong opinions when it comes to this stuff, especially when someone calls me a racist or homophone—which has pretty much only happened at Shocklines. Haha.

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Re: Tracy Morgan

Post by markgunnells on Wed Jun 15, 2011 10:40 pm

It's hard to explain, but for gay people...we don't want to be defined by our sexuality but many of us spent so many years hiding it or lying about it or feeling we would be persecuted because of it, that when we finally do say fuck it and come out of the closet, we wear it like a badge of honor. We're not trying to flaunt it as some accuse us of, but because of the way society has historically tried to relegate us to the role of deviant, our struggles to self-acceptance make our sexuality more a vital part of our identity than I think it does for straight people. Does that make any sense?


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Re: Tracy Morgan

Post by Kenwood on Wed Jun 15, 2011 10:41 pm

Oh, and one more label I despise: The Gay and Lesbian Community. Fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck you! Why do lesbians get their own distinction? Is that the work of "gay feminists"? Haha.

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Re: Tracy Morgan

Post by markgunnells on Wed Jun 15, 2011 10:41 pm

Kenwood wrote:I hear ya. I just take a harder stance when it comes to these things. I grew up befriending good people, not just people like me, you know. I tried hard to see beyond those differences that are walls to so many of us. Thus I had friends of all color, gay and straight, male and female. So I just have strong opinions when it comes to this stuff, especially when someone calls me a racist or homophone—which has pretty much only happened at Shocklines. Haha.

If only there were more like you, but things are much better now than they were even 15 years ago.

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Re: Tracy Morgan

Post by Bordo on Wed Jun 15, 2011 10:53 pm

Oh, and one more label I despise: The Gay and Lesbian Community. Fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck you! Why do lesbians get their own distinction? Is that the work of "gay feminists"? Haha.

I saw the gay community referred to as the "LGBTQ" community the other day. I know what the L,G,B, and T stand for but what's with the Q?

Either way, I thought it was just LGBT. Maybe they'll keep adding letters until the gay community includes everyone on the planet.

When it does, and everyone is a member of the same, big, all-inclusive, gay-but-not-really, world community, Dr. Martin Luther King will smile down on us from his house up in Heaven.

Then Jesus will float by and tell him he's not acting black enough.

Or something like that.




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Re: Tracy Morgan

Post by Shiney on Wed Jun 15, 2011 10:53 pm

I agree with what Ken says...I would also like to toss out my old "Stereotypes exist for a reason" line though...because for every positive role model or further-er for the cause or group...there will inevitably be about 7 who cause all respect said group to slide away.

I mean...I live in the city, close to the "Ghetto" and are all "blacks and hispanics" there trashy thug scum. of course not, most I know or cross paths with are cool...BUT there are those who seem to revere that aspect of the stereotypical reputation and try to glam that shit up for themselves...if that makes sense. I go on tirades about that cultural aspect all the time and my Mom calls me a bigot and that makes me angrier...I just hate assholes and people who seem to have no positive purpose in the community....Color and orientation has nothing to do with it.

An asshole is an asshole...we all got 'em and we can all be 'em.

I think that whole "movement" pf shows like "Queer Eye.." And 'Rupaul's Drag Race" and shit is far more detrimental than other things...They take and foster stereotypical things and lampoon it. Terrible.

Be who you'll be....fuck who you'll fuck. If you aren't hurting any one, I'm cool with that.

Mark, you seem like good people. Ken, I know is good people...as I like to think I am. We stung for awhile after that Shocklines shit went down. Those fuckers are like piranhas.

Oh, and Ken said HOMPHONE in an earlier post, which is pretty funny.


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